|
Post by beatrod on Jul 2, 2019 18:41:52 GMT -5
84 motor, not much done, center mount header, fuel pressure regulator, walbro 255, front mount, la3 and 35#'s, wideband, manual boost controller.. have been working out problems here and there. Thought I had them all worked pretty well but was running in the 10:1 range. It also would accelerate like it should but in the middle of third would kind of "plane out" then would slightly start to pull again at the top side of third. Me being dumb, thought it might have been because it was running a tad rich, dropped the FP a little and took it to about stock pressure. Its also reading closer 11.5:1-11.8:1. Now its breaking up badly anything close to 10psi to the point it starts back firing. If I'm out of boost it drives fine. I was right around 15psi before and it acted fine other then planeing out. I tried closing the gap to .025 but that didn't help much at all. I'm running 93 October and I must admit when I pulled the plugs they had a very small amount of oil on them. Am I running lean even though its saying 11.5 or am I blowing out spark possibly because of oil problems that I'm guessing are from the valve seals. Haven't done a leakdown to rule out piston rings tho. Any help would be very cool!
|
|
|
Post by beatrod on Jul 3, 2019 10:23:18 GMT -5
Figured it out. The T on the upper intake has been rubbing the hood and split the vacuum line going to the tree on the fireworks. So it was running out of gas because the fpr wasnt seeing any positive pressure. Guess I just wasn't watching the wideband gauge close enough at the right time. If it will help anyone, the boost gauge was bouncing erratically and it was backfireing out the exhaust and sounded like anti lag or two step or something similar. Hope this helps someone!
|
|
|
Post by Stinger on Jul 3, 2019 12:45:49 GMT -5
Good to hear you figured it out. That's certainly one of those oddball problems that would have been impossible to identify from here.
|
|
|
Post by napoleon on Jul 7, 2019 9:11:46 GMT -5
Figured it out. The T on the upper intake has been rubbing the hood and split the vacuum line going to the tree on the fireworks. So it was running out of gas because the fpr wasnt seeing any positive pressure. Guess I just wasn't watching the wideband gauge close enough at the right time. If it will help anyone, the boost gauge was bouncing erratically and it was backfireing out the exhaust and sounded like anti lag or two step or something similar. Hope this helps someone! Thank you for posting that. I always like hearing the fix for problems, I never know when I'll run across something similar and being able to pull that up has helped me in the past on odd problems when I'm troubleshooting my own or someone elses stuff!
|
|
|
Post by beatrod on Jul 11, 2019 15:05:23 GMT -5
Bad news. First time iv got to drive it since I thought I fixed the problem. Started just fine drove the first few blocks fine, then started doing it again. Checked what i fixed last time and it was still good. So i thought maybe the regulator wasn't uping under boost. Set it to about 60psi and it still did it. Checked and double checked for boost leaks. Have new plugs but not in yet. Only pushing around 10 psi now and its still doing it. Is the pin for the octane switch suppose to be grounded to the body to put it in premium mode or to another pin? I also checked timing and that was right on 10°, although it does have an 89 pully and belt system, but it wasn't giving any kind of troubles before. I'm thinking either the octane switch is trying to keep it in low grade fuel mode, the plugs/wired, maybe coil.... Heck I dont know at this point. It all seems to be fine. Haven't done any kind of leakdown though. Hopefully it doesnt need to go that far! I can take a video On my phone if that would help.
|
|
|
Post by Stinger on Jul 11, 2019 15:45:07 GMT -5
Ground is ground as far as the premium switch is concerned. Either way, that pin has nothing to do with misfiring, it just adds/removes a few degrees of timing.
You sure the fuel pump isn't giving up? What's AFR showing right before it misfires?
|
|
|
Post by beatrod on Jul 11, 2019 16:03:45 GMT -5
Its right around 11 depending on the pressure i set, then it spikes to like 17:1. But when it misses, I smell gas although it doesn't give smoke or anything. So I was thinking its missing and the o2 is reading the unburnt mix and saying lean when its not. I'll have to take the hood off real quick and watch the FP with boost. The pump giving up would make sense, I just haven't tried it yet. Il go do that. However like I said before, I pushed it to 60 psi thinking it might not be raising and it was holding that time at idle. Might drop driving though.
|
|
|
Post by beatrod on Jul 11, 2019 16:42:29 GMT -5
Yup, FP is completely bottoming out! Idleing I can get it up to about 80psi not even all the way tight(tried for kicks and giggles), so I'm gonna start with the fuel filter, because low flow equals low pressure at volume. So that's the start! Then pump out of the tank and check the hose clumps holding it to sending unit. Thank you stinger! Hopefully simple from here on our. Worst case its low voltage or needing a new pump.
|
|
|
Post by beatrod on Jul 11, 2019 21:36:20 GMT -5
Alright, so i got it ALOT better. Changed filter and pulled pump and the clamps where loose. Filter seemed to be decent but went ahead and changed it. Helped, but still not like it should be. took pump back out to check, and the baffle has broke loose from the tank. Not sure how they are suppose to be, but its like a square velocity stack with the big end down and a plate on bottom with a measly little hole I'm guessing to fill the baffle. Not sure if its suppose to be off the bottom a little or what, but its touching and I'm guessing its sucking the baffle dry faster then it can fill. Pushed it out of the way and put pump back in. Doesn't do it anymore but I still have what feels like spark blowout now still around 10psi and although its not going lean(stay right around 10:1 at about 32-34psi with 19 vacume) this is kindof how it started in the first place. So I'm gonna get more gas to make sure even when it sloshes around it still has enough, change plugs, and if they are available the wires with motorcraft.
|
|
|
Post by Stinger on Jul 11, 2019 23:00:04 GMT -5
Fuel pressure and AFR at idle/in vacuum means nothing for what it's doing in boost. So it being rich at idle with proper pressure doesn't mean there isn't a fuel supply issue.
So now that you've fixed a few things, what's fuel pressure do right before it misfires? It should climb 1:1 with boost so if it's at 40psi fuel pressure at 1psi boost then it should be 49psi at 10psi boost.
If you change plugs put the gap at .025".
|
|
|
Post by beatrod on Jul 12, 2019 12:11:57 GMT -5
Its at 10:1 idle, goes to around 14:1 at cruise, but then jumps back to 10:1 in third WOT. Seems to stay there as its missing but I didn't get the best look because traffic got busy while i was trying. Fuel pressure was showing steady for sure because i had a tester under my wiper arm. If I ease in and get it past the high load area it does fine through the rest of the rpm range and third is the only place it really did it noticeably. Maybe a tad in fourth still but just barely. I'm kinda curious how much oil is on my plugs this time around as well. If its enough to be concerned I'm going to do a leak down test if i can find a hose close by.
|
|
|
Post by Stinger on Jul 12, 2019 12:33:42 GMT -5
It should be 14:1 or so at idle as well as cruise so the fact that it's so rich at idle is another issue for sure.
Have you scanned for codes?
|
|
|
Post by beatrod on Jul 13, 2019 0:03:14 GMT -5
I have not scanned for codes. I drove it for about 10 miles and it acted fine. Then later I decided to give it another try to make sure. All started fine. Boosted fine, afr was still really rich but never went lean. Now its about 12:1 idle, same at cruise sometimes goes to 14.5:1, still about 10:1 under boost, no backfiring. Drive for about 20-30 mins and around 10-15 mins in the pump started getting loud and started cutting out again at around 10psi. Ithought maybe it was getting hot from not enough gas in tank to help cool it. So i filled I it all the way up! Sitting putting gas in must have let it cool some because when i started it, it was quite again. Thought it fixed it. Did a pull to make sure it was going to be ok, did it fine. Shortly after pull it got loud again and started the same symptoms. So i went home before I got stranded. So it turns out somethings up with the fuel system. I'm thinking the pump because it starts out fine, can barely hear it, but after a little driving its like its next to my ear. I'm not trying to make it work overly hard or anything and its really not very old or wore out. Could my problem be something else? And maybe related to the rich afr, sometimes when Im coming to a stop in neutral or even going down the road in neutral it will die. I figured tps was out or base idle was to low for the IAC to compensate although I'm not sure why because its fine at idle, so i reset the base idle and tps but didnt clean the IAC. I do have an egr delete because of the header not having a place to branch off for it but I took off the other motor I got that someone had just made a thick plate for it(kinda rigged) But holds great vacuum(about 20 now) at idle and if I'm in gear slowing down from decent rpm. Tps is at .94 and base idle is right around 975-1000. I'm going to pull the pump tomorrow and see if anything is asque like the clamps. Would starting off quite then getting extremely loud signify a pump that's going out? When it gets loud is when the missing and lean condition starts.
|
|
|
Post by beatrod on Jul 13, 2019 0:25:10 GMT -5
Also, when boost first starts to come on, it seems to get a bit quiter as demands increase until it misses. So perhaps its loud because its so free flowing and as pressure builds it quites down. That's why I'm thinking it may be clamps again.
|
|
|
Post by Stinger on Jul 13, 2019 1:27:49 GMT -5
It sounds like a bad pump but ultimately fuel pressure tells that story. If pressure starts dropping off when it gets loud then you know what's up.
Fix known issues (fuel system) first, then see what problems remain. It's possible fixing fuel will fix stalling or other issues.
|
|